Language Advice

RTLisSB Contributor

Member since 23 April 2022

RTLisSBContributor06 July 2022 11:10:30

177

Whenever I travel for more than three or four weeks, I always spend a few weeks on Rosetta Stone and Duolingo in an attempt to learn at least a few words before I arrive. I find simply being able to say please, thank you, yes, no, etc., to be extremely helpful, and appreciated by the locals.

As I am now looking at much longer stays in VN, two months this year and six next, I want to take language training a little more seriously. To that end, I started both Rosetta Stone and Duolingo in June, a full five months before my trip.

Currently, the plan is to continue with these programs once in country, and hire a private tutor once I arrive in HCMC. Other than a tutor, does anyone have any recommendations for improving my Vietnamese? Any advice in keeping gender/age classifiers straight?

Best regards,

Roger

THIGV ViP

Member since 26 September 2012

THIGVViP06 July 2022 12:35:54

4427

Where are you planning to reside once settled down in Vietnam?

Aidan in HCMC Vietnam Expert

Member since 23 December 2017

Aidan in HCMCVietnam Expert06 July 2022 13:16:09

3894

Where are you planning to reside once settled down in Vietnam?
- @THIGV

VERY prescient question Thigv!

Roger, you probably already know that聽 (within each of which there are again local dialects). Focusing on a dialect not used in your geographical location might prove itself to being more an impediment than an advantage. The differences are more than slight pronounciation differences, and at times are enough to confuse native VN speakers.

My guess is that the programs/apps you are using teach the northern dialect.

There are some very well done "Learn Vietnamese" channels on youtube.

,聽聽,聽聽and聽 links

RTLisSB Contributor

Member since 23 April 2022

RTLisSBContributor06 July 2022 13:36:49

177

@THIGV

Right now, it will be HCMC. I'm not sure what district. I'm staying at the Hotel Continental Saigon for the first 4 days while I secure longer-term accommodation. I don't need to be in an expat neighbourhood. As long as I can walk to coffee shops and restaurants, I'll be happy.

BTW, in addition to advice on learning the language, I'd love some recommendations on neighbourhood within walking distance to the above.

Cheers,

Roger

RTLisSB Contributor

Member since 23 April 2022

RTLisSBContributor06 July 2022 13:39:29

177

Where are you planning to reside once settled down in Vietnam?
- @THIGV

VERY prescient question Thigv!

Roger, you probably already know that聽 (within each of which there are again local dialects). Focusing on a dialect not used in your geographical location might prove itself to being more an impediment than an advantage. The differences are more than slight pronounciation differences, and at times are enough to confuse native VN speakers.
My guess is that the programs/apps you are using teach the northern dialect.

There are some very well done "Learn Vietnamese" channels on youtube.
,聽聽,聽聽and聽 links

- @Aidan in HCMC

Awesome, thanks.

The programs are pretty general and try to teach the basics in a way that most Vietnamese would understand what the learner is trying to say. On occasion, they do point out that a certain word is different in the North or South.

I will visit Hanoi, but I expect I'll remain mostly in the South.

AndyHCMC ViP

Member since 29 February 2020

AndyHCMCViP06 July 2022 13:55:12

1855

@THIGV

Right now, it will be HCMC. I'm not sure what district. I'm staying at the Hotel Continental Saigon for the first 4 days while I secure longer-term accommodation. I don't need to be in an expat neighbourhood. As long as I can walk to coffee shops and restaurants, I'll be happy.

BTW, in addition to advice on learning the language, I'd love some recommendations on neighbourhood within walking distance to the above.

Cheers,

Roger
- @RTLisSB

Your smack in middle of D1, get a sim with 4g and start walking in any direction use google maps to find your way back,, just walk along road until you see/smell coffee,, point to it and try, the street coffee is the sweet vn coffee, the coffee shops, highlands, phuc long, my life cafe etc have the western styles like latte etc. 15k to 70k+ go explore

RTLisSB Contributor

Member since 23 April 2022

RTLisSBContributor06 July 2022 14:26:28

177

@THIGV

Right now, it will be HCMC. I'm not sure what district. I'm staying at the Hotel Continental Saigon for the first 4 days while I secure longer-term accommodation. I don't need to be in an expat neighbourhood. As long as I can walk to coffee shops and restaurants, I'll be happy.

BTW, in addition to advice on learning the language, I'd love some recommendations on neighbourhood within walking distance to the above.

Cheers,

Roger
- @RTLisSB

Your smack in middle of D1, get a sim with 4g and start walking in any direction use google maps to find your way back,, just walk along road until you see/smell coffee,, point to it and try, the street coffee is the sweet vn coffee, the coffee shops, highlands, phuc long, my life cafe etc have the western styles like latte etc. 15k to 70k+ go explore
- @Andybris2020

Will certainly give that a try!

Thanks!

yudirajput Active member

Member since 30 September 2018

yudirajputActive member06 July 2022 16:18:01

@RTLisSB : You will see many coffee shops in every single streets and corners of HCM while walking mate.

Get a sim (I got Mobifone) download google maps and start exploring.

RTLisSB Contributor

Member since 23 April 2022

RTLisSBContributor06 July 2022 16:28:54

177

@RTLisSB : You will see many coffee shops in every single streets and corners of HCM while walking mate.

Get a sim (I got Mobifone) download google maps and start exploring.
- @yudirajput

Awesome, cheers.

Any advice on learning the lingo?

Aidan in HCMC Vietnam Expert

Member since 23 December 2017

Aidan in HCMCVietnam Expert06 July 2022 16:59:00

#10

3894

Any advice on learning the lingo?

R
- @RTLisSB

Oh boy. Only practice, patience, and perseverance will pay off. I learned Arabic many years ago, and though I found it difficult, it was not nearly as difficult at Vietnamese. I can still prattle on in Arabic.

Try this on Google D峄媍h (en; Google Translate).

I'll give you an English word. Click on it, and play the pronunciation on the Google Translate page. Can you hear the difference between each word? I can now, but when I arrived 5 years ago they sounded as though they were the same word.

Let us know how you make out聽

RTLisSB Contributor

Member since 23 April 2022

RTLisSBContributor06 July 2022 17:08:18

#11

177

@Aidan in HCMC

Cheers, I will.

Roger

alexneoh Active member

Member since 18 May 2022

alexneohActive member07 July 2022 03:08:51

#12

@RTLisSB

Not to demoralise, knowing a word or two will sound different to the local eardrum at the very initial stage. You will see question mark from the local forehead or worst simply being ignored if they could not interpret accordingly. Next best is to enforce hand language. As mentioned by Aidan in HCMC, Northern, Central and Southern sound different especially Central, even local outsider could not understand as well. Since you are heading to HCMC, then you will be quite "safe" as mostly youngster are able to speak little english.

Advance preparation is best but advise to just come here and blend in. Open up the ear and listen to the local interact. Then you will judge yourself.

Getting SIM card with data plan is important. You may use the data to navigate yourself throughout the street. Streets between morning and evening, the environment will be totally different for some. Example will be a wet market in the morning while transform into eatery places or mini bazaar in the evening. Should you are lost, read the shop signboard. Majority will have its address stated there in small little wording. ( Tp. or Thanh Pho = City, Q = Quan / District ) Booking for taxi or Grab, such address will be beneficial for your initial pick up point. Important point to note, try not to use your phone while you are walking. If needed to, face to the opposite oncoming traffic direction while walking.

Don't over worry... just enjoy your stay and you will love the coffee as much as the coffee love you.

Jlgarbutt ViP

Member since 13 June 2018

JlgarbuttViP07 July 2022 03:46:39

#13

1426

Whenever I travel for more than three or four weeks, I always spend a few weeks on Rosetta Stone and Duolingo in an attempt to learn at least a few words before I arrive. I find simply being able to say please, thank you, yes, no, etc., to be extremely helpful, and appreciated by the locals.

As I am now looking at much longer stays in VN, two months this year and six next, I want to take language training a little more seriously. To that end, I started both Rosetta Stone and Duolingo in June, a full five months before my trip.

Currently, the plan is to continue with these programs once in country, and hire a private tutor once I arrive in HCMC. Other than a tutor, does anyone have any recommendations for improving my Vietnamese? Any advice in keeping gender/age classifiers straight?

Best regards,

Roger
- @RTLisSB

Find any coffee shop, sit down and chat with the locals. Most speak some English and go from there, you'll soon find someone who is happy to teach you some words in exchange for practicing some English in return.

goodolboy ViP

Member since 08 February 2020

goodolboyViP07 July 2022 04:21:05

#14

2325

Whenever I travel for more than three or four weeks, I always spend a few weeks on Rosetta Stone and Duolingo in an attempt to learn at least a few words before I arrive. I find simply being able to say please, thank you, yes, no, etc., to be extremely helpful, and appreciated by the locals.

As I am now looking at much longer stays in VN, two months this year and six next, I want to take language training a little more seriously. To that end, I started both Rosetta Stone and Duolingo in June, a full five months before my trip.

Currently, the plan is to continue with these programs once in country, and hire a private tutor once I arrive in HCMC. Other than a tutor, does anyone have any recommendations for improving my Vietnamese? Any advice in keeping gender/age classifiers straight?

Best regards,

Roger
- @RTLisSB

Find any coffee shop, sit down and chat with the locals. Most speak some English and go from there, you'll soon find someone who is happy to teach you some words in exchange for practicing some English in return.
- @Jlgarbutt

first sensible advice I have heard on this long drawn out post & after you think you have mastered some words then try it out on a Vietnamese & watch their blank reaction & they wont understand a word you have said!

jayrozzetti23 Serial expat

Member since 14 December 2015

jayrozzetti23Serial expat07 July 2022 06:10:34

#15

815

As mentioned, pronunciation is the major challenge for VNese.

One of the first things you should do is learn the writing system so you have some idea how words are supposed to be pronounced. Because it is based on the Roman alphabet, people get stymied by L1 interference and get into the habit of mispronouncing words.

A common example is "ph峄�" (the soup), which is pronounced more like "fuhr", rather than "foe" because there is a little horn on the O. The question mark indicates the tone (mid dipping-rising).

The famous "谩o d脿i" is pronounced "ow yai" in the south and "ow zai" in the north, not "ow dai". The tone marks indicate a rising tone in the first word and a falling tone in the second word.

Cooked rice "c啤m" is pronounced "germ" with a hard G as in "go" and the horned O similar to "ph峄�". There is no tone mark, so the tine is "mid-level".

in "tr脿膽谩" (iced tea), the second word is pronounced similar to an English D because of the crossbar but it is necessary to pronounce it with the strong rising tone (almost a screech) to be correct. the 'tr" sounds more like "ch". The tone is dropping.

In most cases, you'll be using English. Otherwise, use your phone for google translate or to show a picture of what you want (which can also sometimes cause confusion).

jayrozzetti23 Serial expat

Member since 14 December 2015

jayrozzetti23Serial expat07 July 2022 06:34:00

#16

815

@THIGV

Right now, it will be HCMC. I'm not sure what district. I'm staying at the Hotel Continental Saigon for the first 4 days while I secure longer-term accommodation. I don't need to be in an expat neighbourhood. As long as I can walk to coffee shops and restaurants, I'll be happy.

BTW, in addition to advice on learning the language, I'd love some recommendations on neighbourhood within walking distance to the above.

Cheers,

Roger
- @RTLisSB

Although not the greatest in the world, I feel it's worth having a look at the museums near there:

War Remnants Museum

Ho Chi Minh City Fine Arts Museum

Ho Chi Minh City Museum

Reunification Palace

Of course, you'll undoubtedly see the cathedral as well as the post office designed by Gustave Eiffel, the dude that did the tower.

alexneoh Active member

Member since 18 May 2022

alexneohActive member07 July 2022 08:30:59

#17

@johnross23

Exactly. My encumbrance especially ordering black iced coffee with sugar... "c脿 ph锚膽en 膽谩 c贸膽瓢峄漬g". Till now still could not pronounce it correctly ( after 3 months ). Unless walking in to my regular joint seeing the waitress who know me, else will start all over again at the counter with mouth rumbling while finger swaging towards the photo.聽聽

RTLisSB Contributor

Member since 23 April 2022

RTLisSBContributor07 July 2022 14:11:44

#18

177

@alexneoh

Good advice, thanks, Alex.

I took many French courses over the years that did little for me. However, the two times I went to France and was surrounded by the language was incredible.

Cheers,

Roger

RTLisSB Contributor

Member since 23 April 2022

RTLisSBContributor07 July 2022 14:13:10

#19

177

@goodolboy

LOL, lovely. LOL

gobot ViP

Member since 17 January 2014

gobotViP11 July 2022 08:08:22

#20

1430

Youtube. search for Learn Vietnamese with Donna

She speaks clearly and you will not be bored.

I learned numbers first, the city names video will show you to never assume pronunciation.

Unfortunately she quit after a few videos.

Other youtube teachers like "Annie" I can't understand, "Tieng viet oi" speaks northern.

I took lessons for awhile, most important were the one-on-one for pronunciation.

There are dozens of English clubs where you drop in and you can exchange language. On Facebook, search for the group English Clubs of Ho Chi Minh City.聽 They love native English speakers.

RTLisSB Contributor

Member since 23 April 2022

RTLisSBContributor11 July 2022 18:43:47

#21

177

@gobot

Thanks, gobot!

Roger

RTLisSB Contributor

Member since 23 April 2022

RTLisSBContributor11 July 2022 20:58:39

#22

177

Youtube. search for Learn Vietnamese with Donna
She speaks clearly and you will not be bored.

- @gobot

Just did, and you are right, she's very good. Just twenty videos, but it's a start.

Cheers,

Roger

RTLisSB Contributor

Member since 23 April 2022

RTLisSBContributor11 July 2022 21:02:30

#23

177

Let us know how you make out聽

- @Aidan in HCMC

Wow, very difficult. Some were easier than others. Needless to say, my days of getting by without my hearing aids are coming to an end!

Let's hope I can order coffee in a few years!

Thanks a bunch,

Roger

RTLisSB Contributor

Member since 23 April 2022

RTLisSBContributor11 July 2022 21:03:43

#24

177

@kamawujohn

I think the point is that it would be a trade off, i.e., the VN help you with your Vietnamese and you help them with their English.

Roger

OceanBeach92107 VIP Member

Member since 31 January 2018

OceanBeach92107VIP Member11 July 2022 22:31:16

#25

7249

Thanks for the ideas so what do I stand to gain from English Clubs of Ho Chi Minh city?
- @kamawujohn

Syntax?

Aidan in HCMC Vietnam Expert

Member since 23 December 2017

Aidan in HCMCVietnam Expert12 July 2022 02:01:42

#26

3894

@RTLisSB

The language, being tonal, is full of fun little things like those.

Try these to see what I mean

alexneoh Active member

Member since 18 May 2022

alexneohActive member12 July 2022 04:33:11

#27

@Aidan in HCMC

Just add some to confuse more:

- D峄盿 - Lean on...

- D峄玜 l貌ng - Please ( Northern called V峄玜 l貌ng )

Happy twisting....

OceanBeach92107 VIP Member

Member since 31 January 2018

OceanBeach92107VIP Member12 July 2022 06:00:49

#28

7249

@Aidan in HCMC

Just add some to confuse more:
- D峄盿 - Lean on...
- D峄玜 l貌ng - Please ( Northern called V峄玜 l貌ng )
- @alexneoh

膽农a ~ chopsticks 馃ア

Aidan in HCMC Vietnam Expert

Member since 23 December 2017

Aidan in HCMCVietnam Expert12 July 2022 08:36:32

#29

3894

@johnross23

Exactly. My encumbrance especially ordering black iced coffee with sugar... "c脿 ph锚膽en 膽谩 c贸膽瓢峄漬g". Till now still could not pronounce it correctly ( after 3 months ). Unless walking in to my regular joint seeing the waitress who know me, else will start all over again at the counter with mouth rumbling while finger swaging towards the photo.聽聽
- @alexneoh

Try shortening it up a bit. If you don't include milk (s峄痑), you will get black coffee

c脿 ph锚膽谩 v脿膽瓢峄漬g

alexneoh Active member

Member since 18 May 2022

alexneohActive member12 July 2022 09:53:04

#30

@Aidan in HCMC

Unfortunately I'm in the north and by asking around my peers, nobody seems to understand especially the "va". Here is either "co" or "khong"... nothing more or less. Well... thanks for sharing anyway. ( start tuning my brain now ).